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@snack@ieji.de
Yes, Israel must agree to a ceasefire now - and not invade Rafah.

There, fixed it for you :-)

@palestine

@palestine group
in reply to Miro Collas

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@snack@ieji.de @palestine They had a ceasefire before October 7th. And then they committed the biggest massacre of jews since the Holocaust. And said they would do it again and again and again. Palestinians suffer because of Hamas. Hamas more than Netanjahu has incentive to prolong this conflict so long as useful idiots in the West repeat their propaganda uncritically.
@palestine group
in reply to KatieKat

Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
• •
@bananarama @snack@ieji.de @palestine and by continuing to compare this to the Holocaust you are disrespecting 6 million murdered Jewish victims
@palestine group @KatieKat
in reply to KatieKat

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@MikeImBack Bringing up the Holocaust is relevant because Hamas openly admits to wanting all jews (not just those in Israel) dead. It is relevant because so much of the Pro-Palestine rhetoric is identical to Nazi propaganda. It is relevant because on Holocaust rememberance day Pro-Palis are protesting outside Auschwitz. It is relevant because 'Anti-Zionism' is the same old jew-hatred and if unchecked will lead to history repeated.
@Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
in reply to Gay Whitlam

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@gwit @snack@ieji.de @palestine Jews are indigenous to the Levant. They have lived there continuously since long before the arab conquenst. Was there an influx of jews returning from the diaspora after the establishment of Israel?Yes, but if anything that would be de-colonisation. Anti-semitism didn't start with the Nazis and sadly, it didn't end with them either. If you are looking for a throughline, look up Hitlers good pal Amin al-Husseini, Grand Mufti of Jerusalem under the British.
@palestine group @Gay Whitlam
in reply to KatieKat

Gay Whitlam
Gay Whitlam
• •
@bananarama Oh the Jews are indigenous to Palestine! Well, the ones that were already there. Most Israelis are European immigrants which are descendants of converts, not Palestinian refugees from the Romans etc.
@KatieKat
in reply to Gay Whitlam

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@gwit "Palestinian refugees from the Romans", what are you even talking about? There was no Palestine then, it was the Roman Province of Judea. Where Romans destroyed the -wait for it- jewish temple in Jerusalem. Islam wouldn't even exist for another 600 years or so, btw. The Al-Aqsa Mosque was actually built on the temple ruins. Peak colonizer behaviour right there. And there is actually evidence of shared genetic ancestry among major jewish diaspora groups.
@Gay Whitlam
in reply to Gay Whitlam

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@gwit Now quick, tell me a) Who did the Romans colonize there (and when) and b) how many muslims or 'arab palestinians' lived there at the time. I'm not saying modern day Palestinians don't have some legitimate grievenances against Israel, but calling them colonizers is simply not true.
@Gay Whitlam
in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @gwit 1) Jews have had a continuous presence in what ist today Israel for thousands of years 2) Many 'european' Jews still have genetic markers proving middle eastern ancestry 3) they kept their language, religion and culture and 4) Many Israeli Jews are also refugees from other middle eastern countries where the Muslim majority persecuted them OR reverse the question: what ist your benchmark for losing indigineity? If anything it is de-colonisation.
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam
in reply to KatieKat

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
 — (Internet) •

Ask the Jews who confront the settler state of Israel. It is your internal problem. Exporting the hutzpah will not solve it.

Also, re: (2) I have genetic markers pointing towards Persia. So what?

palestine group reshared this.

in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
•
Funfact: the essential marker of Jewish identity (being born from a Jewish Mother) is pretty much racist per se.

palestine group reshared this.

in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @gwit How? No seriously, how is that racist? Non-jews don't grow their babies in ethnically ambiguous fields, do they? And if you are talking about the religious aspect, anyone can convert (though it is a fairly intensive undertaking as I understand it, you have to learn about the language and religious texts etc.). Nobody is excluded because of their race. They just don't prosytelize like Christians or Muslims.
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam
in reply to KatieKat

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
 — (Internet) •
Whaterver you say, it is obvious that you, Jews, have a massive internal problem of identity (plus an intergenerational PTSD). It is ok, as long as dealing with it does not include killing other people in droves, stealing their land and get innocent bystanders involved.
Israel is a state of mind.

palestine group reshared this.

in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @gwit You don't have to be jewish to support the right of Israel to exist and defend its citizens from the violent attacks of its neighbours. Illegal settlements are not helping (and unlawful by Israeli law btw), but if palestinians want to properly claim the land, they need statehood. Which they have always refused when offered because they oppose recognizing ANY jewish state. If the choice is peace with a jewish state or war, they choose war.
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam
in reply to KatieKat

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
•
As an anarchist I can only wonder why you, Jews, so badly crave state, which is nothing but the monopoly of violence - why not adopt #DemocraticConfederalism, for example. No state, no problem, no war.
#democraticconfederalism

palestine group reshared this.

in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
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@8petros @gwit I can't speak for the jews, but bringing your agenda into this aleady complicated conflict seems less than helpful. There is also a strong religious issue involved, and frankly I don't think anyone can live peacefully next to radical islamists anywhere in the world, jewish or not.
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam
in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @gwit Also, painting the Israeli response to the mass slaughter of their people as some kind of PTSD respone is shameful. Hamas openly said they want to repeat October 7th. What kind of state would just sit and wait for the next attack?
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam
in reply to KatieKat

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
•
The intergenerational trauma started at least with the Shoah, and is openly and officially cultivated as the part of Israeli social conditioning. If you do not know it, you are hardly ready to discuss the topic.

palestine group reshared this.

in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @gwit Yes, there is trauma there, and Israel as a modern indepentent state which offers safe refuge should the world once more turn on its jews (we already see many of the same signs today) will be strongly defended. Understandably so. But if you call education about their history conditioning, that is disingenous. And you can't really be on a high horse on this issue when palesinian children learn this https://forward.com/opinion/566841/hamas-schools-indoctrination-antisemitic-textbooks-gaza/.

The roots of Hamas' terror attack can be found in Gaza’s schools – The Forward

A generation of children in Gaza have been taught to hate from antisemitic textbooks in schools run by Hamas.
The Forward
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @Gay Whitlam

Farhad doesn't like this.

Full-blown famine' in north Gaza: UN thousands of Palestinians are starving - YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3qUkRHyxKE

#Palestine #Gaza #Israel
@palestine


Full-blown famine' in north Gaza: UN thousands of Palestinians are starving

The head of the UN World Food Programme says northern Gaza is now experiencing a 'full-blown famine'.Cindy McCain says thousands of Palestinians are starving...
YouTube
#Palestine #gaza #israel @palestine group
Unknown parent

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@DrALJONES @MikeImBack Like this? On July 12, 2019, at a March of Return rally, aired on Hamas’s Al-Aqsa TV, Hamas Political Bureau member Fathi Hammad implored “you 7 million Palestinians abroad, enough warming up! There are Jews everywhere! We must attack every Jew on Earth – we must slaughter and kill them, with Allah’s help.” He instructed, “[w]e will die while exploding and cutting the necks and legs of the Jews. We will lacerate them and tear them to pieces, Allah willing!”
@DrALJONES @Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
Unknown parent

KatieKat
KatieKat
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@DrALJONES @MikeImBack Or this? May 7, 2021, on a broadcast on Hamas’s Al-Aqsa TV, senior Hamas official Fathi Hammad called for Palestinians in Jerusalem to “cut off the heads of the Jews.” They openly admit this shit. Just not when they cry in front of Western Kameras.
@DrALJONES @Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
Unknown parent

KatieKat
KatieKat
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@DrALJONES @MikeImBack I tell you waht they said and your answer ist basically 'they said they didn't say it and if they did they didn't mean it'? Anyone can easily find this information
@DrALJONES @Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
Unknown parent

8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_
•
To make it fully usable in future conversation, would you care to provide a source?
in reply to 8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@8petros @DrALJONES @MikeImBack https://blogs.timesofisrael.com/what-hamas-leaders-actually-want-in-their-own-words-part-1/ I just did a quick search for direct quotes and found it here but variations of this are all over, including the 1988 Hamas founding charter (I know there's a new one now. You can advocate for civilians in Gaza and acknowledge that the antisemitism in their cause is pervasive. So long as Hamas is in control, peace will be near impossible.
@8Petros [Atlas Unshrugged]_ @DrALJONES @Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
Unknown parent

KatieKat
KatieKat
• •
@DrALJONES @MikeImBack And yet he ist still part of Hamas leadership. And it doesn't seem like he changed much https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/12/hamas-israel-religious-organization/676303/

Is Hamas Waging a Religious War?

The group’s religiosity is real, but flexible.
Graeme Wood (The Atlantic)
@DrALJONES @Mike. 🩼🇨🇦
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